[foxtrot]

tay's tee games wrote:

Yeah I totally get this and obviously F is just me being a bit of a troll (more like a D- but I just never come back to it). There are certainly some songs on Spirit that can get to be a lot with the frequencies but I find the songs at the core of every track seriously shine through and the instrumentation/mix aids and embellishes it. Whereas with Danse I find it really difficult to find the song through the noise a lot of the time, and whilst I appreciate the experimentation and uniqueness and importance of it within their discography, I just get very little reward from listening to it.

Having said all that, I really enjoyed listening to There's An Arrow again with the pre-IIN tracklists, so I'm looking forward to isolating certain Danse tracks and giving them a shot again (plus reading other people's perspectives on them, which should help).

Great response tasty games. Unbanned! Danse really is a unique beast. Really curious to see your thoughts if/when Danse tracks come up in the pre-IIN thing. I wonder how some nice 5-6 minute out of context bites might help you sink your teeth in. Or not maybe! We'll see!

[Stan]

I saw someone post they'd never listened to Hollinndagain and I thought damn they seemed like an interesting and knowledgeable poster. But it just shows. It's like your neighbour who takes out your bins if you forget or trims your hedgerows if they're doing their own or knocks on the door when there's some birdshit corroding the paint of your convertible sports car and then you find out they have a locked dungeon full of Nazi memorabilia.

[tay's tee games]

Tay's Tee Fritzl

[Stories and Games]

this is making me stop and realize that i probably have never listened to danse manatee all the way through. it's possible that i've heard every song on it in full? maybe? i love this band more than every other band i swear but yeah for some reason have been entirely content just never truly sitting down with that one (probably just fooled by its reputation as The Bad One)

especially silly of me since "danse manatee is the true animal collective debut album" is an opinion i strongly hold hehe

[Stan]

I don't listen to H and DM enough these days but they're undoubtedly part of peak AC for me and I'm grateful to those involved in the thread and song choices that have out me back on them this week. It's given me a buzz I've not felt in ages, even with Defeat.

I don't get behind the ST to MPP peak, everything prior to ST is spectacular in its own way, before they were 'just a great band' writing slightly weird songs with slightly weird production and instrumentation. I completely accept their 'maturity'/ageing and I don't expect or think they should or could be writing music like they did when they were in their early/mid-20s but they definitely tapped into something then which they've either moved away from or can't access any more.

[tay's tee games]

Not that anyone was wondering but I relistened to Danse and Hollinnd a few times each today for the first time in aaaaages and would like to upgrade Danse to a D+ and Hollinnd to a C+.

I still find the first three tracks of Danse unlistenable and it's frustrating that I know there are great songs buried under a lot of chaotic mixing choices across the rest of the record, but Ahhh Good Country, In the Singing Box, Bad Crumbs and Throwin the Round Ball are bangers. Ahh Good Country is s tier and I have seriously slept on it.

Listening to that followed by Hollinndagain is a huge revelation because you can HEAR THE SONGS. Yeah there's a lot of mess that I largely don't find riveting to listen to but the tunes mostly shine.

[blindmowing]

Danse Manatee didn't click for me until I listened to it on vinyl at dusk alone on an autumn day. For me, it's a very setting-dependent record. If I listen to it in the wrong setting I have to turn it off, but in the right setting it's a perfect AC record. That's why for my rankings I've listed it highly, but it can't be in the top tier because its dependency on other factors.

[rohcti]

tay's tee games wrote:

Right on. Definitely listen to Campfire again though, especially if Sung Tongs is A+ to you (which honestly it is to me a lot of the time). Sometimes it has less to focus in on I find since it moves at a more languid pace but god damn does it have THE fuckin vibes.

You've got me hyped to listen, Sung Tongs is my favorite but the few times I've tried to listen to CS I just get so bored. I'ma try again soon

I will say I know Doggy pretty well though, love that song

[wilandhugs]

DM is way better on speakers and the vinyl helps it a ton. Not a headphone album at all, kinda opposite of Spirit. I don't think the frequencies are as bad as spirit tbh, sure there are more but it never gets to the level of say Untitled. What takes away from it slightly is that it's very much an experience album and I can't really listen to anything from it on its own. Ahh Good Country, Meet the Light Child, In the Singing Box, and of course Essplode are highlights but I enjoy it the whole way through. I think it helps to listen to it in a pretty dark environment also, totally agree with blindmowing about twilight or late fall/winter. Also you cannot multitask with this album, you gotta pay attention to it in full or else it'll get on your nerves as background noise. Hard to describe. Definitely their weirdest album by far and I don't really blame people for not getting into so heavy, it's a total mindset album. Kinda like psychs lol, gotta set for it.

I love Campfire Songs but it's the opposite with Danse where I tend to lull out from it so hard because it creates such an environment. Always makes me stop what I'm doing, put good headphones on, and close my eyes. I really love the way De Soto De Son works as a closer, such a beautiful and brilliant piece. Manages to capture so much while being so simple.

[foxtrot]

I find it totally baffling that there seems to be a bunch of people here who have never really listened to CORE AC ALBUMS!

How is this possible?! Never having listened to Hollinnd or Danse?! Someone recently said they've only heard Eucalyptus once! This is absolute madness. It's like saying you love Italian food but you've never tried Ravioli.

Can totally understand not having heard random rare tracks, remixes etc. Even the recent soundtracks. There are plenty of those random tracks that I haven't heard too. Also, I know new people find the band and are still making their way through the back catalogue. But for most of us, I just assumed everyone had heard every core release a hundred times.

Even my least favourites like The Painters EP, Buoys... I've still listened to them at least 15-20 times each... because they're FOOKING AC! COR BLIMEY!

[dansemanatee]

foxtrot wrote:

How is this possible?! Never having listened to Hollinnd or Danse?! Someone recently said they've only heard Eucalyptus once! !

Pretty sure that was me lol...

But ya even so no shade but I feel like ppl who frequent a board for a band would have at least heard all their main albums

[Stories and Games]

it's just not how my obsessiveness manifests itself idk! i tend to love and experience art in a way that's much more impulsive than measured, so even with my fav band there'll be releases i just don't get around to even if i'd probably like or love them. also have never fully heard:

young prayer
pullhair rubeye
keep
TTG
greaper
sleep cycle
tangerine reef
crestone (but like, who among us)

i think i've managed to muscle my way all the way through tomboy one single time (even tho surfer's and jetty are my fav panda songs), by the second half it just gets so exhausting and numbing. ditto with eucalyptus except that's because it's too long and too demoey

idk different nervous systems make for different fandoms

[jfw7]

i'm curious if there's an age thing too, people who grew up listening to tapes/cds/soulseek'd directories straight through vs people growing up streaming?

i definitely check out halfway through some of the avey solo stuff and i've also never listened to tangerine reef, fwiw

[foxtrot]

Stories and Games wrote:

it's just not how my obsessiveness manifests itself idk! i tend to love and experience art in a way that's much more impulsive than measured, so even with my fav band there'll be releases i just don't get around to even if i'd probably like or love them. also have never fully heard:

young prayer
pullhair rubeye
keep
TTG
greaper
sleep cycle
tangerine reef
crestone (but like, who among us)

i think i've managed to muscle my way all the way through tomboy one single time (even tho surfer's and jetty are my fav panda songs), by the second half it just gets so exhausting and numbing. ditto with eucalyptus except that's because it's too long and too demoey

idk different nervous systems make for different fandoms

Are you the same with other favourite bands? Are AC your favourite band?

Truly foreign to me! I can't imagine calling any band an all time favourite if there is this much of their material that I don't care for. That's a second or third tier artist kinda thing. Love a few albums, like a few others and have a few I've never really listened to. Bands/artists like Autechre, Fela Kuti, Low, Microphones/Mount Eerie (off the top of my head) are maybe examples of artists in that category for me. Big back catalogues, have listened to a lot but don't love them quite enough to cover everything.

But I'm on an AC board because they're among the very few top tier bands.

Maybe jfw7 is right and its more a generational/cultural thing about how I consume music. I definitely grew up on tapes/cds/albums. Still now rarely listen to isolated songs and much rather put on full albums. Maybe my obsessiveness is much more 'completist'. Knowing all the major releases is about understanding everything's context and place in the journey. And it's like knowing a partner. Embracing all the messy parts that make them the one you love.

Totally respect that everyone approaches art/music/love/life in whatever way works for them btw. Just fascinating.

[Stories and Games]

wrote:

i'm curious if there's an age thing too, people who grew up listening to tapes/cds/soulseek'd directories straight through vs people growing up streaming?

speaking for myself i was a CD/itunes kid through and through and was/am a Full Album Experiencer, but i think that's sorta at odds with how my brain actually works and so i end up with gaps

i do wonder if music becoming a thing that exists almost entirely On The Internet has made it rarer for kids to become superfans of specific bands. even people like me who grew up mostly pre-streaming were/are very beholden to internet curated canons of which records in a given discography are the good ones, so you end up with a very curated experience that's totally removed from the now-romanticized "buy a record at the store that you've never heard before simply because you love another record by the same band" experience

[Stories and Games]

foxtrot wrote:

Are you the same with other favourite bands? Are AC your favourite band?

Truly foreign to me! I can't imagine calling any band an all time favourite if there is this much of their material that I don't care for. That's a second or third tier artist kinda thing. Love a few albums, like a few others and have a few I've never really listened to. Bands/artists like Autechre, Fela Kuti, Low, Microphones/Mount Eerie (off the top of my head) are maybe examples of artists in that category for me. Big back catalogues, have listened to a lot but don't love them quite enough to cover everything.

But I'm on an AC board because they're among the very few top tier bands.

Maybe jfw7 is right and its more a generational/cultural thing about how I consume music. I definitely grew up on tapes/cds/albums. Still now rarely listen to isolated songs and much rather put on full albums. Maybe my obsessiveness is much more 'completist'. Knowing all the major releases is about understanding everything's context and place in the journey. And it's like knowing a partner. Embracing all the messy parts that make them the one you love.

Totally respect that everyone approaches art/music/love/life in whatever way works for them btw. Just fascinating.

yes AC are my favorite band lol. to clarify those are albums i simply haven't heard all of, i'm sure i'd at least basically like most of them. i'm this way with joanna newsom too, have heard all her main albums but have only listened to Have One On Me all the way through maybe two or three times? never listened to the early EPs, never listened to the live EP. i'm sure they're very good and i'd like them if i listened to them! maybe i will someday and be kicking myself! but like with AC i think i end up forming my own sort of messy personal version of the discography in a way? like, danse manatee is an album that just happens to fall outside of the squiggly border of my very intense love for AC.

i get envious sometimes of people who are so thorough and methodical in their obsessions, find it very charming and admirable. but just isn't me yeah.

[NightlifeMingus]

since everyone else is doing it, here’s my stab at a personal ranking

S TIER - unimpeachable masterpiece
Sung Tongs
Feels
Strawberry Jam
Water Curses
Fall Be Kind

A TIER - brilliant work of art
Spirit
Prospect Hummer
Merriweather
ODDSAC (as a visual album)

B TIER - excellent overall
Campfire Songs
Ark
Centipede Hz
Meeting of the Waters
Time Skiffs

C TIER - good when i’m in the mood but not one i return to
Danse
ODDSAC (no visuals)
TTG
Bridge to Quiet

“It’s just not my jam” TIER - it’s just not my jam
Painting With
The Painters

[archie]

agree w Stan in that cfire songs/Danse/hollin in that naive magic god flowed through them category…: absolutely top tier for me. but hey I’m that guy

[Alcohol]

Stan wrote:

I saw someone post they'd never listened to Hollinndagain and I thought damn they seemed like an interesting and knowledgeable poster. But it just shows. It's like your neighbour who takes out your bins if you forget or trims your hedgerows if they're doing their own or knocks on the door when there's some birdshit corroding the paint of your convertible sports car and then you find out they have a locked dungeon full of Nazi memorabilia.

Lol thank you. There has to be a Beatles freak who hasn’t yet heard Help!

[Stan]

I just think what a curious circumstance to have listened to CHz or Time Skiffs or 7s enough to have an opinion of them but not to have entwined Pullhair and Young Prayer into your DNA. It's not a criticism, I just feel like this is Golden Age formative stuff when they were crackling with creative energy.

I can only assume and agree with jfw7 re generational/habitual factors. I'm not someone who streams music but I imagine some of these albums and EPs aren't on there. That's the main reason I don't. My music collection is like 99% digital and I have an A&K DAP that's served me very well. Before that, I had iPods. Do they even make them any more? Anyway, I'm used to managing my own collection and listening to full albums, even the crap ones.

Here's my considered ranking:

S++
Strawberry Jam
Feels
Sung Tongs

S+
HCTI
Water Curses
Person Pitch
Spirit

S
Pullhair Rubeye
Hollinndagain
Prospect Hummer
Danse
Fall Be Kind
Merriweather Post Pavilion

A+
People
Campfire Songs
Young Prayer
Homies

B+
Down There
Buoys
Tomboy
Wastered

B
Sleep Cycle
TTG
Oddsac
Reset

C
Time Skiffs
Greaper
Meeting of the Waters
Cows
(Isn't It Now) - based on bootlegs

E
Centipede Hz
Painting With
The Painters
7s

U
Everything else.

[Stories and Games]

the only stuff on your list that isn't on spotify is wastered and oddsac (and unfucked pullhair ofc assuming that's what u mean), but i've always listened to AC near-exclusively through cd rips or filesharing anyway. i think the only generational difference that might be at play here is simply that i was still in elementary school when AC's cultural moment burned out, so by the time i was listening to them in 2016 danse/young prayer/pullhair accounted for a much smaller percentage of their discography than they did in 2007, and no one but the true diehards were still evangelizing about them at that point anyway.

well also, i've said something to the effect of "that's just how my brain works" a number of times here re: erratic listening habits but probably shouldn't discount the possibility of that also being a sort of generational difference as well. even if the thing we're currently calling adhd has always existed, someone growing up with it in the 00s/10s is gonna come out the other end with a very different nervous system from someone who grew up with it in the 80s/90s

anyway i'm sure someday (maybe very soon) i'll sit down with the few early releases i've missed and be totally delighted

[MFpotus]

Stan preemptively putting IIN in C tier bums me out

[Stan]

If everything comes out as good as the singles, it could be a solid B+/B.

[wilandhugs]

I'll echo as a young person that it's all a generational thing, but Im the sort to make sure I check out a whole discog when I get into the band-- which means I haven't listened to Pullhair in like 8 years. But everything else I pretty much will throw on like what SnG was saying. Also basically echo everything you said about the digital era and how it's ruined a lot of the early mystique... but I also grew up like obsessively listening and ranking whole discographies since I've been like 9, just at random and methodical. Ask me about any Muse album (only good one in full is Origin of Symmetry)

[awesome]

new little panda bear interview talking about doin it right

[Stories and Games]

stan curious where day with the homies goes on there, or is that included in Everything Else

[jfw7]

I think homies is so so good and having only the one boot (right?) was such a sweet scenario for demoitis. hopeful that sinister grift gives us the same experience

[Stories and Games]

homies is like, anachronistically good. good without even the slightest need for equivocation, noah pulling out 25 inexplicably excellent minutes of music out of nowhere two decades into his career. that ep makes me so dang happy

[Stories and Games]

vinyl mix i mean ofc

also i'm totally in the dark on any of the SG material, would be lovely if that turned out to be another late career left fielder

[Stan]

Stories and Games wrote:

stan curious where day with the homies goes on there, or is that included in Everything Else

Major error on my part. I'll say A+.

[foxtrot]

Stan wrote:

I don't get behind the ST to MPP peak, everything prior to ST is spectacular in its own way, before they were 'just a great band' writing slightly weird songs with slightly weird production and instrumentation. I completely accept their 'maturity'/ageing and I don't expect or think they should or could be writing music like they did when they were in their early/mid-20s but they definitely tapped into something then which they've either moved away from or can't access any more.

Totally agree that the 'golden era' extends well before Sung Tongs. For me, Danse and Campfire are 4.5 stars and Ark is a 5 star absolute untouchable moment of sheer awe inspiring brilliance.

I think they've just naturally moved away from that sound and matured/evolved into new territory. They always have. I think they could certainly access something like that again but obviously there was an incredible youthful sense of discovery in that period that gave it the unique energy and almost spiritual feeling that it had. I think projects like MotW and Tangerine Reef tap into a similar sense of exploration but with the maturity of their later years. I guess I'm agreeing with you! I don't think they could tap into quite the same energy because they're not the same people. However, I don't think they would ever want to anyway. I never encountered a band as focussed on constantly looking forward.

I think its also worth noting that we actually got more album material from that pre-Sung Tongs period than basically any other era. Danse, Hollind and Ark - that's essentially three albums. All distinct in their way but all definitely part of a certain ragged, expressive, primal whole. When I think about other AC eras, none have ever yielded 3 albums worth of material. Campfire Songs could even be included to make 4 albums in that style. So they actually did more of that kind of stuff than they have ever done of anything else. So that's nice to have.

[Avey Tane]

Ark is Animal Collective crawling out of the primordial ooze, Kid Amnesiac is Radiohead crawling into it. Don't know which is more admirable but I'm biased

[blindmowing]

foxtrot wrote:

Stan wrote:

I don't get behind the ST to MPP peak, everything prior to ST is spectacular in its own way, before they were 'just a great band' writing slightly weird songs with slightly weird production and instrumentation. I completely accept their 'maturity'/ageing and I don't expect or think they should or could be writing music like they did when they were in their early/mid-20s but they definitely tapped into something then which they've either moved away from or can't access any more.

Totally agree that the 'golden era' extends well before Sung Tongs. For me, Danse and Campfire are 4.5 stars and Ark is a 5 star absolute untouchable moment of sheer awe inspiring brilliance.

I think they've just naturally moved away from that sound and matured/evolved into new territory. They always have. I think they could certainly access something like that again but obviously there was an incredible youthful sense of discovery in that period that gave it the unique energy and almost spiritual feeling that it had. I think projects like MotW and Tangerine Reef tap into a similar sense of exploration but with the maturity of their later years. I guess I'm agreeing with you! I don't think they could tap into quite the same energy because they're not the same people. However, I don't think they would ever want to anyway. I never encountered a band as focussed on constantly looking forward.

I think its also worth noting that we actually got more album material from that pre-Sung Tongs period than basically any other era. Danse, Hollind and Ark - that's essentially three albums. All distinct in their way but all definitely part of a certain ragged, expressive, primal whole. When I think about other AC eras, none have ever yielded 3 albums worth of material. Campfire Songs could even be included to make 4 albums in that style. So they actually did more of that kind of stuff than they have ever done of anything else. So that's nice to have.

100%

Great post. I was a ST->MPP = Golden Run guy until the pre-TS album listening schedule you put together a few years ago and then I totally fell in love with Campfire Songs & Ark. Spirit, Danse and Hollin are really strong and heady psych trips, but it's the CS/Ark double trouble of 2003 where I start to feel my head AND heart exploding ... they tap into something spiritual and primal and deep... 2000s AC untouched by anything else in the history of music.

I really need to give TR more listens... I had one REALLY good listen to that album while watching the film, but on its own I haven't had any transcendent listens...should tap into that album tonight.

[nothingmastered]

I've been 2001-pilled too lately. Danse/Hollind/Campfire material written and performed that year, they really were tuned into some wild magic.

Ark is a terrible and beautiful culmination of that era. It feels confused and existential, like they're searching for something but unsure what. Like they were these ethereal un-self aware spirits that gained awareness suddenly in a cold world

[destiny]

Gotta listen to Pullhair rubeye. Im not even lying when i say thats some of the bands best tangentially related stuff. Super stripped back Feels-esque songwriting. Like the younger sister to feels that is just as fucked up and weird.

Ahh good country is really sweet because it is in all shapes and forms just a sung tongs song. Legit. It;s funny because when you really listen to AC their trajectory kinda makes so much sense, the songs relate to eachother compositionally imo so well no matter how many elements they introduce or remove in the writing process or studio. Gotta listen to it on a good sound system. The way feedback and frequencies are played with is just insane for it to be their "second" album.

[foxtrot]

Whenever I’m listening to Danse Manatee it feels like the greatest AC album. Like right now.

It has this deep, thrilling primordial feel. To me it’s like the first swamp creature with legs climbing out of the water and discovering land. Full of this intense feeling of discovery. Kinda dirty and grotesque and clumsy but totally unfettered and innocent and full of awe and overflowing with possibility.

[dansemanatee]

foxtrot wrote:

Whenever I’m listening to Danse Manatee it feels like the greatest AC album. Like right now.

Feel the same way. My user is literally danse manatee. Listen to it asap!! And when ur done listen to both versions of pullhair rubeye, the unreversed version is probably the best ac release overall imo.

[rohcti]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8Ecs8oWjck&feature=youtu.be[/youtube]

This recording of Safer is nuts

[foxtrot]

That whole show is nuts. First tour I saw them on.

[rohcti]

Lucky, I haven't listened to the whole thing yet but the setlist is pretty crazy