[kafkaesque]

iKahn wrote:

kafkaesque wrote:

yo guys, let's found a new publication that appreciates good music like animal collective

This isn't the point.

The point is that AC is creating something elusive, and escaping the broader scope of folks who take it in thinking it'll be something it isn't.

You think Spirit or HCTI was widely appreciated on as broad of a scope as is expected out of them these days? Fuck no. It's niche as shit. That's their place. MPP was some kind of coincidence...The band always existed on their own plane, but intersected so closely with the general public's taste on MPP that they were catapulted to relevancy by proxy.

They're doing what they've always done. Some folks don't jive, others do. Is this not apart of the polarizing charm of the band?

this may come as a surprise to you, but pitchfork gave spirit an 8.9 and HCTI an 8.7. tinymixtapes gave spirit a 5 and HCTI a 3.5. they were in fact acclaimed albums (although naturally less appreciated than later records because of AC's progression toward pop and building fanbase)

[Synusoid]

Pan wrote:

Synusoid wrote:

Friendly reminder that you're insecure and an idiot if some reviewer affects your personal view of a band's work. Not really saying anyone is doing that though

that doesn't sound very friendly

Yeah, well, music reviewing sucks and it's a shame that an X/10 sways people into different modes of thinking.

I don't mean to be totally snarky though, I really do wish that people would just take music reviews with a grain of salt. I still love Painting With just as I did before of course, but even me writing posts about such a topic at this moment is indicative of my own insecurities. Really I shouldn't even care that people are having a fit about this

[Sputnik Monroe]

Hiff Cluxtable wrote:

Friendly reminder:
get your head out from those mags
and websites who try to
shape your style
take a risk just for yourself
and wade into the deep end of the ocean

[myersbeard]

p4k review says "suffice it to say that I agree with Nietzsche when he said that it is man alone who suffers so deeply that he had to invent laughter."
wtf
and the reviewer doesn't even talk about the new animal collective album
just how he misses old animal collective

[Lacrimosa]

that was actually a great review and I agree with it. like I explained in my post earlier, something is missing (magic, the same word he used), and that review explained it very well. THIS IS AC'S OWN FAULT, I'M SORRY BUT ALMOST EVERYTHING THEY DID BEFORE CHZ WAS JUST PURE GENIUS( T H E Y FUCKING C H A N G E D MY LIFE, and only The Beatles did that for me on the same scale) , and this isnt....its not that I expect them to do anything, and I'm disappointed because they didn't do what I wanted, the only thing want is that fucking AC-magic. and it IS here, but just not half as much as on albums before CHZ.

The fact that things like Justin Bieber has te same score (and that sum fucker like Jamie XX even got a 9.3) is stupid ofcourse, but the score also reflects the progression as a band, and if you compare this with albums like MPP/feels/ST/SJ etc... it's pretty reasonable to say this is about 2/3 points worse(ofc scores/grades don't really work for art, so don't focus to much on that particular thing)

[Synusoid]

lol, goodnight y'all

[Cussing Bum]

Saw this comment from a non fan on Reddit:

"If you love this album, this one review by one writer from one outlet shouldn't affect that whatsoever.
If you hate this album, don't use this one review by one writer from one outlet as some sort of evidence backing up your opinion."

[Dividual]

Lacrimosa wrote:

that was actually a great review and I agree with it. like I explained in my post earlier, something is missing (magic, the same word he used), and that review explained it very well. THIS IS AC'S OWN FAULT, I'M SORRY BUT ALMOST EVERYTHING THEY DID BEFORE CHZ WAS JUST PURE GENIUS( T H E Y FUCKING C H A N G E D MY LIFE, and only The Beatles did that for me on the same scale) , and this isnt....its not that I expect them to do anything, and I'm disappointed because they didn't do what I wanted, the only thing want is that fucking AC-magic. and it IS here, but just not half as much as on albums before CHZ.

The fact that things like Justin Bieber has te same score (and that sum fucker like Jamie XX even got a 9.3) is stupid ofcourse, but the score also reflects the progression as a band, and if you compare this with albums like MPP/feels/ST/SJ etc... it's pretty reasonable to say this is about 2/3 points worse(ofc scores/grades don't really work for art, so don't focus to much on that particular thing)

Definitely disagree about Centipede. Still digesting this one but it seems like a really solid album to me, and it feels absurd to give it a 6.3.

[cledbury]

How did monkey been to burntown (7) get a higher score than this? Haha

[Lacrimosa]

Dividual wrote:

Lacrimosa wrote:

that was actually a great review and I agree with it. like I explained in my post earlier, something is missing (magic, the same word he used), and that review explained it very well. THIS IS AC'S OWN FAULT, I'M SORRY BUT ALMOST EVERYTHING THEY DID BEFORE CHZ WAS JUST PURE GENIUS( T H E Y FUCKING C H A N G E D MY LIFE, and only The Beatles did that for me on the same scale) , and this isnt....its not that I expect them to do anything, and I'm disappointed because they didn't do what I wanted, the only thing want is that fucking AC-magic. and it IS here, but just not half as much as on albums before CHZ.

The fact that things like Justin Bieber has te same score (and that sum fucker like Jamie XX even got a 9.3) is stupid ofcourse, but the score also reflects the progression as a band, and if you compare this with albums like MPP/feels/ST/SJ etc... it's pretty reasonable to say this is about 2/3 points worse(ofc scores/grades don't really work for art, so don't focus to much on that particular thing)

Definitely disagree about Centipede. Still digesting this one but it seems like a really solid album to me, and it feels absurd to give it a 6.3.

I think this is a step forward from CHZ, and fuck that 6.3 really....
I just agree that something is missing,
I do also agree that he could've surely wrote more about this album. and again... fuck that 6.3..

I do love the record though, it's better than I expected, it keeps on growing and im having alot of fun listening to it. an awful lot more than with CHZ.

maybe this album makes me smile because some of the magic IS shining through, wich was missing on CHZ for me, but it's impossible for me to not look back on the masterpieces they've made and conclude that this isn't nearly as good, ofcourse that affects my experience with every album they will ever put out, I can't help that. fuck that score... but you can't compare that score with Justin Bieber, right?

[moop]

the last bit of On Delay sounds like panda doing the willy wonka sample in daily routine

[Stanshant]

As someone who has said similar things to that reviewer on here, and who felt that CHz was quite uninspired, and felt that Tomboy and GR were ultimately a little underwhelming, and who's grown up/old a bit and almost only ever listens to music in the car, I was perfectly prepared to say that the truly magical, meaningful AC music was perhaps behind me, even if I didn't have the right to say it was behind them.

As someone who feels that the 'in and out' pop structures don't really allow for the euphoric freedom that is the highlight of their music for me, I would say this is the best thing they've done since MPP. Nothing, including MPP, comes close to what they did before (including the MPP boots - arguably their peak), but that's my preference based on many factors, probably including the fact that I first discovered them when I lived in China for a few years and the excitement and deep emotions and novelty and sensory overload of that absolutely wonderful life changing time is so strongly associated with Animal Collective. I can never go back to that, and neither can they, and that still hurts sometimes six or seven years on, even though I'm happier and more content than I ever have been. Point is, I get what this reviewer is saying but this is still a brilliant record, with or without context.

My only criticism would be that I feel more and more that this is Dave's band, and Noah makes much stronger contributions to Dave's songs than his own songwriting. He's always been quite one note in his composition but he is very repetitive here. I think Dave writes better for him than he does for himself, essentially.

[Me Tiger]

Lacrimosa, maybe you haven't found the right angle to see the magic yet. Not that you have to find it though. Maybe someday it will just click. I feel it there, right there in the sound and the melodies — something very close to my heart. But I can imagine people seeing it flat and uninspired, because of the palette probably. I'm just inside the music already and can't feel it different now. Maybe my perceptions will change with time, but I feel the magic now.

[Me Tiger]

moop wrote:

the last bit of On Delay sounds like panda doing the willy wonka sample in daily routine

Yes, and also one sound in Bagels reminds me of Bluish.

[iKahn]

GetFucked wrote:

your dismissal of artists like kanye and beyonce (who are in their own way on the forefront of 'experimental pop') as mainstream trash people only like cus it's on the radio (does the radio even play kanye's recent stuff?), and your claim that anyone who doesn't like painting with just 'doesn't get it' cus it's too advanced or whatever - makes you seem like a pretentious 15 year old who's just discovered experimental music or something

Without getting too far off topic...

I'm not saying anyone who dislikes Painting With doesn't get it, I'm saying that just because you may not like it doesn't mean it's just bad or it's among the worst things they've released...I'm saying that one of the few consistencies throughout their career is their trajectory for going to unusual places...and we're left often not quite knowing what to think...and here we are again.

[preacherben]

[quote="Takyon" just want to make good enough music to sell a record, have a tour, and make enough income to support themselves.[/quote]

this kind of thinking is just a huge missrepesentation of what being a performance artist entails. these guys literally are trying to support themselves with their music - like every other pop musician. this isn't a point of praise or criticism, it just is. like you could literally use that description for any artist.

i hate this idea of purity, cause all it does is glorify a past that's already been way too glorified, and it ignores a future that includes AC making good tunes for as long as they want

eveybody wants Feels, Sung Tongs..but its not hard to see why that's an unreasonable desire.. i've never heard of a band or artist who just blatantly goes back to an old sound like that. If the guys would've done some trite Feels-y sounding album with long cuts and guitars, they would've gotten even more criticism. you want the old AC and don't want the new AC, but if the new AC was old AC you'd want that, if the old AC was the new AC, you'd probably find ways to criticize it.

i don't mind the p4k review, the music the boys make now is very specific/is less accessible than it seems. you have to really dig their songwriting and care less about their textures and sounds (even tho that's why i fell in love with them to begin with). and if you don't like the way they write songs, then you probably won't like the album

like the only thing that bothers me is when people proclaim this band dead...it's just this needless "i created you now I will end you" bullshit

tbh this album is woefully out of place in 2016, but that's the beauty and respectability of it. it's not a part of some modern wave, it's not the cultural zeitgeist, it's an AC album with some really killer songs. i think in a few years this might be their best remembered - for music nerds - because it has some of their strongest songwriting in like 10 years.

[Lacrimosa]

Me Tiger wrote:

Lacrimosa, maybe you haven't found the right angle to see the magic yet. Not that you have to find it though. Maybe someday it will just click. I feel it there, right there in the sound and the melodies — something very close to my heart. But I can imagine people seeing it flat and uninspired, because of the palette probably. I'm just inside the music already and can't feel it different now. Maybe my perceptions will change with time, but I feel the magic now.

that could be very true.
and I have to say, I always have immense expectations for anything related to AC, just because I had never felt that magic that I felt with everything they did before CHZ compared to any band on earth (maybe the Beatles, in a different way), and ofcourse it's precisely because of that, because of my expectations, because of their genius around that time that I was disappointed with everything they did after ODDSAC. but having said that, CHZ never felt like that magic to me, not even after all these years, and I'm afraid that's forever.
However i DO feel alot more magic on this album and I DO enjoy it alot!
I never said it was not an good album, or that this stupid 6.3 is a good score, it just doesnt feel nearly as special as what they did in the past. and ofcourse that could also be mostly me not able to hear the magic, I can only say how I feel about it and that P4K review felt like I felt.

[moop]

preacherben wrote:

this kind of thinking is just a huge missrepesentation of what being a performance artist entails. these guys literally are trying to support themselves with their music - like every other pop musician. this isn't a point of praise or criticism, it just is. like you could literally use that description for any artist.

i hate this idea of purity, cause all it does is glorify a past that's already been way too glorified, and it ignores a future that includes AC making good tunes for as long as they want

eveybody wants Feels, Sung Tongs..but its not hard to see why that's an unreasonable desire.. i've never heard of a band or artist who just blatantly goes back to an old sound like that. If the guys would've done some trite Feels-y sounding album with long cuts and guitars, they would've gotten even more criticism. you want the old AC and don't want the new AC, but if the new AC was old AC you'd want that, if the old AC was the new AC, you'd probably find ways to criticize it.

i don't mind the p4k review, the music the boys make now is very specific/is less accessible than it seems. you have to really dig their songwriting and care less about their textures and sounds (even tho that's why i fell in love with them to begin with). and if you don't like the way they write songs, then you probably won't like the album

like the only thing that bothers me is when people proclaim this band dead...it's just this needless "i created you now I will end you" bullshit

tbh this album is woefully out of place in 2016, but that's the beauty and respectability of it. it's not a part of some modern wave, it's not the cultural zeitgeist, it's an AC album with some really killer songs. i think in a few years this might be their best remembered - for music nerds - because it has some of their strongest songwriting in like 10 years.

WELL PUT!

[Lacrimosa]

preacherben wrote:

[quote="Takyon" just want to make good enough music to sell a record, have a tour, and make enough income to support themselves.

eveybody wants Feels, Sung Tongs..[/quote]



I don't want any of that, and I don't think alot of other people who are disappointed would really want that either.
I'm all for the changes they went through, that was exciting ! ;
from ST->FEELS(!)->SJ(!)->MPP(!!)-FBK (!) and also ODDSAC.

and I think everybody was excited about AC changing, that is part of what makes them great, but that doesn't mean that it's always a good change.
for me the change (CHZ->PW) that took place is a good one (and MPP->CHZ was the only one that wasn't for me), it's just not nearly as exciting as the former ones.


maybe this score isn't that much of a bad thing. I think this forum hasn't been this much alive since a long time. I LOVE YOU ALL and I LOVE YOU AC <3

[preacherben]

i feel you. i'm not trying to defend it to the grave or tell you guys "you better fucking like this you fucks". i just felt like putting my thoughts. p4k knows how to get us AC fans going lmao

[Me Tiger]

Lacrimosa wrote:

I never said it was not an good album, or that this stupid 6.3 is a good score, it just doesnt feel nearly as special as what they did in the past. and ofcourse that could also be mostly me not able to hear the magic, I can only say how I feel about it and that P4K review felt like I felt.

Yeah, I didn't mean that you feel wrong or have to find something (which even can't be pointed at). You feel the way you feel and it's totally ok already.

[dio]

that p4k review barely has a lick of stuff abt the music and is mostly explicitly about p4ks past reviews of ac albums in the 00s weird i expected something different and not abt the dude finding imself cuz of sung tongs. wtf. absolutely horrible. id like to ignore it because we're prbly all wasting out time thinking about it and tap makes a good point abt it being a 3.1/5 tho... weird how p4k indoctrinates the internet to their weird fascist music-as-gladiators bull shit.



any way.... on delay is my jam. crossing my fingers they rlly jam out on that one on friday night

[Jonzo]

Fascinating how one dickhead on Pitchfork's opinion warrants so much debate. They love this btw, you're playing right into their hands.

[Vovenarg]

that guy's just upset because they keep changing the taste of AC

[Gravity]

Everything about this thread is hilarious right now

[dominoswriter92]

My list, after listening to the Amazon samples no more than 10 times; the Crosley rips no less than 3 times; the album no more than 4 times:

Tier A- "Recycling", "The Burglars", "On Delay", "Golden Gal", "Summing the Wretch", "Vertical", "Hocus Pocus"
Tier B- "Bagels in Kiev", "Natural Selection"
Tier C- "FloriDada", "Lying in the Grass", "Spilling Guts"

The album is 8.5/10 to me. For some reason, I wasn't expecting to like this as much as PBVSGR, my top played album of 2015 (at least, based on FD and Litg); I think I still prefer PBVSGR as a whole, but the Tier A songs are a little bit better, in my mind.

P4K's review is only dismaying because they gave TLOP such a high score. MBDTF is one of my favorite albums, but to me PW >>> TLOP. It's just a more enjoyable, less disjointed listen.

In general, I feel like a lot of people who were college-aged between ST and SJ (2004-2007) are disillusioned with the direction AC has taken. I first noticed this when I started looking at PBVSGR reviews: nearly every mediocre review compares it negatively with Person Pitch(sometimes Tomboy, too).

It seems that, now that they've reached a certain level of success, they can't be "just good" anymore; they have to release another transcendent album that exceeds all expectations and inspires a new generation of musicians, like the last one.

[Jonzo]

Can someone remind me why we're comparing PW to TLOP again, missed that one

[Gravity]

^ yeah honestly you could see this coming from a mile away.

Also if you dont think floridada or lying in the grass are among the best songs on the album(I see so many people putting them on the bottom) then you listened to the singles way too much. They are two of the most distinct/catchiest on this.

[dominoswriter92]

Jonzo wrote:

Can someone remind me why we're comparing PW to TLOP again, missed that one

Sorry. They are two highly anticipated albums by two artists I like coming within a week of each other. I acknowledge it is an unnecessary comparison.

Gravity wrote:

^ yeah honestly you could see this coming from a mile away.

Also if you dont think floridada or lying in the grass are among the best songs on the album(I see so many people putting them on the bottom) then you listened to the singles way too much. They are two of the most distinct/catchiest on this.

I was never too big on "FloriDada". I like "Lying in the Grass" a lot more, but not as much as the other songs on the album. But I also think the mark of a great album is the lack of a clear consensus on which songs are best.

[Me Tiger]

Joe Biden is our last hope.

[amber]

Lol 6.2 tho? Lol damn

[tdegenaro]

Jonzo wrote:

Can someone remind me why we're comparing PW to TLOP again, missed that one

Here's the thing about #TLOP & Painting With, beyond the two highly anticipated records probably more than just a handful of Collected Animals, P4K readers, and all of the world mostly and otherwise uninteresting comparisons is that (sorry, us) Painting With isn't a cultural zeitgeist, lightening rod, polarizing band (or any other over-written blog-baiting buzzword buzzfeed pummels into meaninglessness in their 'journalism.' The way Animal Collective released Painting With is revolutionary to them, its a zeitgeist to us, but Ed Sheeran released his album before touring it, Taylor Swift released her album before touring it, the Foo Fighters released their album before touring it.

Some of you (and in this thread, it doesn't really matter so I really hope this is the final word on it and Ye can stay in the other Music threads and we can go back to talking about Painting With without some c*** at Pitchfork ruining our party think everything Kanye has done in 2016 (maybe sooner?) is the man turning around and doing this: .

But you'd be being a complete asshole to not recognize that, for laughs, obnoxiousness, a point, whatever, that Ye did something dramatic & different. The Life of Pablo release cycle has been literally unlike anything else, ever. It is relevant to discuss the release cycle with the record when reviewing it, because the way Kanye did it is as much a part of the art as the music itself. And by the way, the music on TLOP is fucking good.

I haven't listened to Painting With. The three singles are fucking good too. I'll fanboy over the Collective until the day I die. That includes thinking what they did is revolutionary, but I'm not so diluted in my love of this band that I can't recognize how they did what they did is for us. The album is for the world. The rollout was for their own experimentation. We're the people that give a shit about that. Us, and our band. Let's be happy about that cool relationship we have.

If the P4K reviewer wants to be flabbergasted the world has changed since he graduated from college and stopped drinking cough syrup. You guys don't gang up on the [opinion deleted] people who listened to a low quality bootleg once and wrote this album off, so who gives a flying fucking shit about what P4K says? Frankly, who gives a shit what anybody says? Animal Collective has tenure. A 6.2 on their tenth record? In like nearly their 20th year as a band? Who thinks Animal Collective is going anywhere? I sure as shit don't.

I can't wait for Friday. I'm glad P4K covers them, gives information about their tours, posts their singles, and even if they had given the album a 0.1, a few kids would have discovered that band and a few of those kids would have checked the album out, based on wanting to form their own opinion around who and what this "Animal Collective" band is.

And that's fucking great.

out.

[tdegenaro]

Having not listened to Painting With yet, on the strength of the three singles alone I can say it isn't 1.4 less than CHz, and I like CHz. Maybe if they had reviewed the superior Geodude cover things would be different...

[dio]

theyre both really good and the both just came out.

im over it.... BUT deerhunters fading frontier recently got a 8 something it's ok and that thing is so lacking in innovation and is really nothing new or especially good for the band, i mean its solid bu so little substance there compared to this, and this one also has the band clearly pushing their sound forward once again. i just dont get it but i mean their system obviously fall apart when u compare scores we alrdy know that, and like ya it doesnt matter why do i care blah blah, sorry. just kinda dumb. guess p4k rlly is completely "washed up". sux for them.. ewe need a new one. have for like 5 years

[Takyon]

I've read somewhere that P4K's scores aren't decided by the reviewers themselves but by the editors, which would probably explain their sometimes arbitrary ratings. So if anyone takes issue with the number, don't pin it to the critic.

iKahn wrote:

Takyon wrote:

That's the purpose of criticism: assessing how something is received and if anyone can just summon the argument that any piece of media is somehow a pure artistic divinity then both my thoughts and yours are entirely useless.

You're talking exactly like someone who came in off the hype-train from MPP and are expecting their work to revolve around your expectations and hopes and aspirations for the group. It is all obviously subjective. What I've personally always found most profound about them is their ability to sculpt the sound into a world of it's own, and Painting With is a kind of concentrated version of some of the sonic trickery they've displayed over the past several years combined with plenty of freshness to keep the mixed bag in equilibrium.

Gimme a break. I've been listening since 2006/7 and have loved discovering how different each of their subsequent releases sounded. The only thing that i've come to expect from hearing a new AC record is top-notch songwriting and personally, I find that PW doesn't fit the bill. My problem with PW is quite the opposite of what you are implying: it sounds like a lesser, choppier version of what they've already done.

[tdegenaro]

wrote:

like ya it doesnt matter why do i care blah blah, sorry

You need to focus on having posivibes and sneaking recording equipment into that venue on Friday. Sending love.

[dio]

i think someone is gonna try and record it. im really into this record/feeling generally positive thanks

[LostWisdom]

My outlook on life and my relationship to music vastly improved when I stopped reading pitchfork...

Pitchfork define inauthenticity in the music world...

Their reviews corporatist, pseudo-intellectual garbage intended to sell you a product...

In fact I'm almost glad that they disliked it because now my praise for the album isn't tied in to pitchfork's opinion.

#gibbs

[tdegenaro]

Diomedes wrote:

i think someone is gonna try and record it. im really into this record/feeling generally positive thanks

Good. Can't wait to hear it, both the boot, your (and everyone's) reviews of the shows, etc. Much love.

[tdegenaro]

LostWisdom wrote:

My outlook on life and my relationship to music vastly improved when I stopped reading pitchfork... Pitchfork define inauthenticity in the music world...

I think "inauthenticity" [sic] in the music world is defined by in-authentic musicians, not reviewers. I don't want to get too Jack White (who am I kidding, yes I do, Jack White is the other god I pray to at night) but the reviewers, corporate, Conde Nest, 'in the pocket' so to speak, don't make music or art. Musicians do. Pitchfork, while I sometimes disagree with their COMFUCKINGPLETELY SUBJECTIVE assessments of albums I personally enjoy, I find their writing (mostly) to give me the opportunity to engage in a discourse about things I love, and in that discourse (particularly when I'm disagreeing with a review - El VY, for a recent example) I often discover even more of what I love about that particular project from that discourse.

I don't really think Pitchfork has any kind of impact on my life. If it did, I'd go as far as to say it offers a positive influence, because I find it to be a good source of information about a lot of artists I love. More power to you if you've got the energy to blaze those trails to find tours, singles, other information yourself. One click's plenty for me, and what Ian Cohen & crew think of my favorite bands doesn't really shake my faith in those bands.

Anyway, good for you for finding your truth. Hope you find a better reason to enjoy Painting With than to spite one guy that wrote one opinion on one website.